Author Topic: Is EQ essential? (Read 4740 times)

craziechild · « **on:** May 03, 2008, 02:40:39 AM »

masters...

often we talk about doing tuning through crossover points, angling, placing and also gain setting... but seldom talk about eq... so do EQ share the same importance as the ones mentioned above?

please share...

Zenn · « **Reply #1 on:** May 03, 2008, 02:45:16 PM »

eq will help in the fine tuning, after u get all the xovers & positioning settled. its just like salt, pepper & seasoning, after u get all the recipe and cooking methods correct.

built · « **Reply #2 on:** May 03, 2008, 05:29:52 PM »

craziechild,
depends on who you are asking that question; the answer can either be "yes" and "no"...

some call themselves "purist" or what we call take it as it is. another group will say
that the car acoustic is lousy... too much absorption and reflection therefore EQ is
deem necessary.

so which group do you belong to?

craziechild · « **Reply #3 on:** May 04, 2008, 01:21:54 AM »

to me EQ is needed as a fine tuning... i use EQ in my system and found it very useful to tune my system sound the way i like it to be... correcting the weakness in my system...

but some of the senior icer at my place differ that EQ is not important and can be totally leave out of the system... i always see some icers here even they have good HU like 9855, D2, CD7000, only the xover is used while the EQ is totally left out... in the end of the day, some change their amps, component set or wires claiming that they are the culprits of not good SQ overall...

so come a question in my mind... is EQ essential to the sifu, and also the experienced?

bafukie · « **Reply #4 on:** May 04, 2008, 09:58:35 AM »

what eq ru using craziechild?

built · « **Reply #5 on:** May 04, 2008, 10:52:26 AM »

craziechild,
it doesn't matter what other think. if EQ is important to you,
then it's essential!

craziechild · « **Reply #6 on:** May 04, 2008, 12:16:01 PM »

i use the 701... EQ on the individual channels...

panzer · « **Reply #7 on:** May 04, 2008, 10:35:37 PM »

EQ, if your set up is well balanced enough, and the car's interior acoustics doesn't fight with your installed system, then no need EQ.

If you want some flexibility, and like to tweak your sound on the fly, then EQs are the way to go!

kevyeoh · « **Reply #8 on:** May 05, 2008, 10:06:50 AM »

i belong to the group who believes in EQ...cause personal experience la... EQ really help my previous system to sound a lot a lot better...

from that day onwards, i support EQ if it's needed....
:)

you can always try to use EQ first before upgrading your other components like speaker or amps....right? so for me, no harm trying and go for EQ...

mnkh27 · « **Reply #9 on:** May 05, 2008, 12:06:59 PM »

Quote from: kevyeoh on May 05, 2008, 10:06:50 AM

i belong to the group who believes in EQ...cause personal experience la... EQ really help my previous system to sound a lot a lot better...

from that day onwards, i support EQ if it's needed....
:)

you can always try to use EQ first before upgrading your other components like speaker or amps....right? so for me, no harm trying and go for EQ...

the main question would be

1) Does your system sound reasonably good without EQ?
If it does not, it's best to delve deeper into understanding what is really holding back your system rather than add an EQ to solve it. If it does sound good, by all means add the EQ to give you better flexibility to fine tune the system to perfection or closer to perfection. :)

2) Does adding an external EQ induce other problems?
If adding an EQ requires you to spend on extra cabling that you cannot afford now, it may be best to keep it on hold rather than go half cooked. 'KISS' applies here. The more you 'hantam' into your system chain, the more complicated it gets to detect nagging problems. Another problem with adding EQs is whether the EQ itself changes the resolution, tonal and noise floor in your system. If it does, you may want to think twice or look harder to find another EQ that fits your system without robbing any qualities to begin with. If you can't find one, then maybe you should KISS again! :)

3) Do you have the patience to tune an EQ?
Honestly, nobody is that free to sit in your car for hours, a couple of times a day or in a week to tune the EQ and for FOC. :D Furthermore, it is not recommended to tune your system for more than 30mins each session. Ear fatigue, concentration fatigue, car charging system fatigue sets in. You must at least train your ears so that you can participate in the tuning process and to give the tuner a second opinion. The tuner may be very well familiar with guitars and pianos but maybe you are better with the other strings and percussions. That way, we do not end up going in circles. Most people that add an EQ without the patience will end up settling with an average point. If your system is already good to begin with, this average point does not really justify the expense in adding that EQ. Money could have been spent elsewhere with greater results.

ahmisuhairi · « **Reply #10 on:** May 05, 2008, 12:11:29 PM »

thats what i call explaination from sifu....

mnkh27 · « **Reply #11 on:** May 05, 2008, 12:58:23 PM »

Quote from: ahmisuhairi on May 05, 2008, 12:11:29 PM

thats what i call explaination from sifu....

Errr, how can. My sifu is you guys lar.

octave · « **Reply #12 on:** May 05, 2008, 05:22:50 PM »

hehehe ... what a good thread with many great sifu contributions .

may i venture further to add that the purist theory is classified
into 2 categories :

first , a group of enthusiasts defined the purist theory as
the faithful reproduction of music as recorded . this classification
is held in high esteem by many music enthuasists .

this definition disregards whether it has been faithful to the music . as you are
aware , the purity of sound is very dependent upon the quality of equipment used .
and also the itchy fingers of the audio engineers .

second , another more defining view is that the music is faithfully
repoduced as played by the musicians . the rich and famous artistes are
always struggling to retain their artistic rights from the record companies .
this view is held by the more serious enthusiasts .

built ... so you are very right .....

when the first definition has been achieved .....

hehehe .... there is the second version to conquer ....

kevyeoh · « **Reply #13 on:** May 06, 2008, 12:10:41 AM »

Quote from: mnkh27 on May 05, 2008, 12:06:59 PM

the main question would be

1) Does your system sound reasonably good without EQ?
If it does not, it's best to delve deeper into understanding what is really holding back your system rather than add an EQ to solve it. If it does sound good, by all means add the EQ to give you better flexibility to fine tune the system to perfection or closer to perfection. :)

Previous system doesn't sound good without EQ...after adding in EQ...sounded so much better according to my taste...it was harsh and the midbass not enough oomph...EQ seems to solve all the problems... hehe...

2) Does adding an external EQ induce other problems?
If adding an EQ requires you to spend on extra cabling that you cannot afford now, it may be best to keep it on hold rather than go half cooked. 'KISS' applies here. The more you 'hantam' into your system chain, the more complicated it gets to detect nagging problems. Another problem with adding EQs is whether the EQ itself changes the resolution, tonal and noise floor in your system. If it does, you may want to think twice or look harder to find another EQ that fits your system without robbing any qualities to begin with. If you can't find one, then maybe you should KISS again! :)

yeah...agree with your half cooked theory...i'll try not to cook something halfway now learning from past experience... hehe...

3) Do you have the patience to tune an EQ?
Honestly, nobody is that free to sit in your car for hours, a couple of times a day or in a week to tune the EQ and for FOC. :D Furthermore, it is not recommended to tune your system for more than 30mins each session. Ear fatigue, concentration fatigue, car charging system fatigue sets in. You must at least train your ears so that you can participate in the tuning process and to give the tuner a second opinion. The tuner may be very well familiar with guitars and pianos but maybe you are better with the other strings and percussions. That way, we do not end up going in circles. Most people that add an EQ without the patience will end up settling with an average point. If your system is already good to begin with, this average point does not really justify the expense in adding that EQ. Money could have been spent elsewhere with greater results.

yup... this is my problem now... i also have a feeling that by adding in EQ...i might just end up with average point instead of getting the system closer to perfection as you said above...

built · « **Reply #14 on:** May 06, 2008, 02:03:36 PM »

ah yes, the second version; ol' wise one.
can it be acheived without an EQ in a car?

craziechild · « **Reply #15 on:** May 06, 2008, 11:54:03 PM »

the reason behind adding EQ into my system was because i had a lack of mid-bass problem as some have known it and tried to solve my problem through forum...

anyway... my installer that time keep on insist that i change the front mid from the 6" to 8" which i was very reluctant as i had just weld 6" copper speaker baffle onto my door frame... so i tried to EQ the mid lower end and sure enough it helps then i went on to EQ the whole front stage... but during that painful process of getting the EQ curves right... i got a lot of people saying to me that i am wasting my time...

so after i would say my first succesful EQ tuning... still wondering is it an important part in the tuning process?

to me... my system now... its important... when on defeat on mode... the sound is really really thin... no "energy" and "no f-e-e-l-i-n-g" from the singer...

cheers...

wengweng · « **Reply #16 on:** May 07, 2008, 09:44:06 AM »

system with very good installation and good tuning should need few EQing. This is what I read from the kuailow competition forum where the competitors said the make their installation as good as possible.

But my car 5 band EQ also not enough. hahahaha

octave · « **Reply #17 on:** May 07, 2008, 01:40:22 PM »

Quote from: built on May 06, 2008, 02:03:36 PM

ah yes, the second version; ol' wise one.
can it be acheived without an EQ in a car?

well ... it is obviously not that impossible .
but the possibility of it is virtually imposssible ...
with the current sonic performances of audio hardwares
amongst the mobile enthusiasts .

however ... the possibility is subjected to
varying degrees of interpretation depending
upon an individual exposure and appreciation of
music .

if EQing is unneccessary ... the gifted studio engineers will
be en masse unemployed ...

and ultimately a dying breed ...

built · « **Reply #18 on:** May 07, 2008, 04:01:08 PM »

so, craziechild, here's your answer...

Quote from: octave on May 07, 2008, 01:40:22 PM

if EQing is unneccessary ... many studio engineers will
be unemployed ...

or is it?

craziechild · « **Reply #19 on:** May 08, 2008, 12:57:11 AM »

think so... but that raised another question... if the recordings are all well EQed... then we EQ our system would spoil their good works?

or it doesnt?

Zenn · « **Reply #20 on:** May 08, 2008, 11:16:40 AM »

the engineers listen to it in a square room, good monitor speakers, placed widely apart, room also soundproof sometimes.

so now listening to car have to eq all over again lor, thats why...

craziechild · « **Reply #21 on:** May 08, 2008, 11:55:07 AM »

hmmm... good point... thanks for enlighten me...

roy77 · « **Reply #22 on:** February 08, 2009, 10:13:23 PM »

i guess the tuning is a big challenge... most of them just sit on it after fade up with the tuning... well that was for me once upon a time...

built · « **Reply #23 on:** February 09, 2009, 10:34:53 AM »

Quote from: roy77 on February 08, 2009, 10:13:23 PM

i guess the tuning is a big challenge... most of them just sit on it after fade up with the tuning... well that was for me once upon a time...

you must be very old... or are you in a fairy tale world?
just kidding...

Audiophiliac · « **Reply #24 on:** February 09, 2009, 05:22:00 PM »

Quote from: built on February 09, 2009, 10:34:53 AM

you must be very old... or are you in a fairy tale world?
just kidding...

I would suspect tha Roy77 means you was born at 1977

roy77 · « **Reply #25 on:** February 10, 2009, 12:38:19 AM »

forgot to mention... im still playing active... lol...
it was a way to *poison those that are deciding to go active...

if its a fact then never stop poisoning, we poison to make everyone happy with the final results dun we...

kevyeoh · « **Reply #26 on:** May 21, 2009, 09:17:01 AM »

i wanna ask here....is 16band EQ good enough or 31band EQ is the way to go?

Usually which freq band we play around most to tune? i don't think we adjust every single band right?
is there any critical band we should focus on more?

carcrazy · « **Reply #27 on:** May 21, 2009, 11:35:13 AM »

EQ is critical for me in the finishing stage of tuning. Go for external EQ that uses discrete components rather than processor. You will hear the big difference between the two.Its not about how many band of EQ but the quality and outcome of the sound that matters the most. If budget permits than go for 30 band eq.

Zenn · « **Reply #28 on:** May 21, 2009, 12:07:57 PM »

just a matter of precision and also knowledge and experience

31 band will be more precise than 16 band, also harder bcoz u need to know which of the 31 band to adjust, so u can start of with 16 band and graduate later to 31 band...

carcrazy · « **Reply #29 on:** May 22, 2009, 01:01:29 PM »

16 band should be sufficient unless you are going for extreme high-end setup.
Mostly you need to eq around midrange region like 250Hz,500Hz and etc..
Again it depends on your system. There's no fix rule to EQ.

Xai-V-iaX · « **Reply #30 on:** September 02, 2009, 12:17:05 AM »

How do you guys rate AUDIO CONTROL EQL? Planning to hook up a pair of em to my Left & Right Channels of my components. Current setup, Diamond Audio M661 Components played 'Active' with Nakamichi PA-2004.

Zenn · « **Reply #31 on:** September 03, 2009, 12:26:47 PM »

its a good EQ, go ahead, all the best..